Title: Mayfield claims Evernham's absence hurt team
Description: Jayski
Crazie - August 17, 2006 03:19 PM (GMT)
Jeremy Mayfield claims in court documents that team owner Ray Evernham's "close personal relationship" with development driver Erin Crocker distracted his team and kept the owner from being an instrumental part of the No. 19 Nextel Cup team, whose struggles this year eventually led to Mayfield's firing. Mayfield made that allegation in his lawsuit against Evernham Motorsports filed Aug. 9 in North Carolina Superior Court in Iredell County after Evernham Motorsports informed Mayfield Motorsports Inc. on Aug. 7 that Mayfield would not drive the car in the Aug. 13 race at Watkins Glen. Evernham responded in an affidavit that he has worked diligently to make sure that the No. 19 team had the personnel and resources to be successful. See full report on SceneDaily.com.(8-17-2006)
hummm..."things that make you go bwawah"
NeverBeenThawed - August 17, 2006 03:27 PM (GMT)
No comment. Well, maybe I'll be back later with something to say.
lalabee - August 17, 2006 03:35 PM (GMT)
Them's more jabs right there! :boxing
Katie9 - August 17, 2006 03:39 PM (GMT)
I'm not saying a word on the Ray/Erin situation, if there even is one...
Peter - August 17, 2006 03:43 PM (GMT)
From the full article on SceneDaily.com:
| QUOTE |
| "If I have been 'tanking' the performance of the car, it must have started with the first race of the season because car performance has been equally terrible all year," Mayfield says in his affidavit. "The cars have not been good, and the engines, particularly recently, have been weak." |
That statement concerns me a little. Kasey and a few other drivers have said all season how strong the Evernham engines have been, and the loop data proves that by showing Kasey as one of the fastest cars on the frontstretch and backstretch of a lot of tracks.
I wonder if Jeremy's engines have been weak since Chicago. I'm hoping not...it's difficult to see the truth based on statements from the two sides. But EMS surely must have realized that they needed to keep the 19 in the top 35, and I can't imagine them hurting that team based on Jeremy's comments. Maybe Jeremy made that statement up to get back at Ray? I don't know. I'll stay neutral in this because there's a lot more going on than we can tell from reading the articles.
Melissa - August 17, 2006 04:01 PM (GMT)
personal issues should not enter into this, it is a performance issue and obviously there has been an issue with that all season. there comes a time when decisions have to be made. you are never going to please everybody, the one left on the outside looking in is never going to be happy. but the change still has to be made.
How can missing 3 race make an owner an "absentee". Ray attends far more races than most owners.
NeverBeenThawed - August 17, 2006 04:02 PM (GMT)
If performance were an issues, why's Erin still in the truck?
MaryLovesNASCAR - August 17, 2006 04:10 PM (GMT)
Uh, no comment on this. I'm still trying to think of something to say. :wacko:
~ Mary
Melissa - August 17, 2006 04:12 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (NeverBeenThawed @ Aug 17 2006, 12:02 PM) |
| If performance were an issues, why's Erin still in the truck? |
to gain experience, no body expected her to blow the everybody away in her first full season. you are talking about someone whose experience is in lighter weight, higher powered cars on dirt tracks. there is a big difference between those and the heavier, less power on pavement. the learning curve is huge that is obvious. some people can pick it up quickly others need more time.
has it entered any body's mind that she lost her father to cancer as a teenager and this "personal" relationship is nothing more than that of a father figure.
Hell, it isn't hard to see why any woman would be attracted to him. Hell from my point of view Ray Evernham is one hell of a catch.
I have a feeling that no matter where JM ends up in a few years we will be seeing round 3. How many teams does this guy have to go through before people start realizing that his inability to work with team members is a major problem.
Oh and Erin is 21st in the standing, not 36 as Jeremy was when Ray pulled him out of the car.
NeverBeenThawed - August 17, 2006 04:14 PM (GMT)
Peter - August 17, 2006 04:29 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (NeverBeenThawed @ Aug 17 2006, 12:02 PM) |
| If performance were an issues, why's Erin still in the truck? |
As Erin’s admitted on her NASCAR.com weekly feature, she has her ride and is keeping it because she’s a female driver. Because of that and the fact that she’s driving for a team like Evernham Motorsports, she’s extremely marketable. Danica Patrick is, by far, the most popular driver in the IRL because she’s a female, and if Erin becomes successful in Nextel Cup, she could become that popular as well. General Mills wants to sponsor Erin Crocker, not Evernham Motorsports. If Erin would be released, then I imagine General Mills would leave the team, and Ray would shut down the 98 truck. It’s all about marketing. I bet that even though she’s wrecked and tore up a fair amount of cars, she’s still making more money for Evernham Motorsports than she costs them.
Erin’s been slow to develop, but she is developing and showing improvement on restarts and in traffic. Her last two Busch races have really impressed me compared to how she ran earlier in the season. I predict that her truck team will move to Busch, and Erin will be full-time next year in the 98 General Mills Dodge, which will use the owner points of the 9 this season. The 9 will probably start off as a new team and continue their Ultimate Charger marketing package with Kasey, Elliott, and Scott.
MidnightPrism - August 17, 2006 04:32 PM (GMT)
Jeremy was with an R&D team all year. I knew he would struggle & I knew this would be his last year at Evernham.
Surely he realized that too
Crazie - August 17, 2006 05:38 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (kk9mm88 @ Aug 17 2006, 11:12 AM) |
| QUOTE (NeverBeenThawed @ Aug 17 2006, 12:02 PM) | | If performance were an issues, why's Erin still in the truck? |
to gain experience, no body expected her to blow the everybody away in her first full season. you are talking about someone whose experience is in lighter weight, higher powered cars on dirt tracks. there is a big difference between those and the heavier, less power on pavement. the learning curve is huge that is obvious. some people can pick it up quickly others need more time.
has it entered any body's mind that she lost her father to cancer as a teenager and this "personal" relationship is nothing more than that of a father figure.
Hell, it isn't hard to see why any woman would be attracted to him. Hell from my point of view Ray Evernham is one hell of a catch.
I have a feeling that no matter where JM ends up in a few years we will be seeing round 3. How many teams does this guy have to go through before people start realizing that his inability to work with team members is a major problem.
Oh and Erin is 21st in the standing, not 36 as Jeremy was when Ray pulled him out of the car.
|
Thank you! You took my thoughts and actually made sense of it all. lol
NeverBeenThawed - August 17, 2006 05:48 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (Peter @ Aug 17 2006, 10:29 AM) |
| As Erin’s admitted on her NASCAR.com weekly feature, she has her ride and is keeping it because she’s a female driver. |
That's too bad. I don't think she should be in the car just because she's a woman. That's the forced diversity that I don't support. Eventually the sponsors will want performance or they won't re-up with them. I for one want the most talented person possible in any ride, regardless of gender/race/whatever.
Crazie - August 17, 2006 06:24 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (NeverBeenThawed @ Aug 17 2006, 12:48 PM) |
| QUOTE (Peter @ Aug 17 2006, 10:29 AM) | | As Erin’s admitted on her NASCAR.com weekly feature, she has her ride and is keeping it because she’s a female driver. |
That's too bad. I don't think she should be in the car just because she's a woman. That's the forced diversity that I don't support. Eventually the sponsors will want performance or they won't re-up with them. I for one want the most talented person possible in any ride, regardless of gender/race/whatever.
|
Not always true...look at Michael Waltrip...he's a trip to listen to and has a great personality...but thats seems to be where it stops these days. and you can't say it's the equipment...DEI has some really good equipment and he still did poor. Even with his 30 whatever finishing average his sponsors stick with him from team to team to team. At some point, unfortunately, it's about marketing...Mikey is a very marketable person...even though he doesn't get top 10 finishes or wins, he is great with the fans and with the media. Same type of deal goes with Erin...just it's more of what she's "packing" than her personality.
NeverBeenThawed - August 17, 2006 06:29 PM (GMT)
That is true, to a point. I just don't see General Mills reupping with them and Petty Enterprises, is all. JMO.
lalabee - August 17, 2006 06:42 PM (GMT)
Maybe Jeremy is being super crafty. He knows it's about marketing and appeal and is throwing fuel on the Ray/ Erin :nanahump flame.
Not many women, who supported Erin in the first place because of her gender, are going to support a female driver who's carrying on a relationship with her boss. Adding to the speculation, as an insider, gives a lot of clout to the rumors and really puts a dent in just how marketable Erin is.
NeverBeenThawed - August 17, 2006 06:43 PM (GMT)
Thank you for saying what I'm clearly incapable of putting into words.
Melissa - August 17, 2006 06:49 PM (GMT)
Neither Ray nor Erin are stupid. I have no doubt that they are well aware of the effects of these rumors on her career.
Just as Jeremy is not stupid and is well aware of the effects of these rumors, just as he was well aware of the consequences of his actions. He should have learned that lesson when he pulled similar crap to get out of penske. it bit him in the ass the same way to only then there were only 8 races left in the season.
I have seen nothing in the contact between them that proves Jeremy's accusations.
lalabee - August 17, 2006 07:04 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE |
| I have seen nothing in the contact between them that proves Jeremy's accusations. |
Well, the reason why is right here in your post:
| QUOTE |
| Neither Ray nor Erin are stupid. I have no doubt that they are well aware of the effects of these rumors on her career. |
It's not like this is a new "rumor." Correct me if I am wrong, somebody, but wasn't their relationship as more than an owner/driver actually confirmed earlier this year?
Regardless, Jeremy DOES know exactly what he's doing and he's coming out guns a-blazin'! He's making some low blows very subtly. He saw what he comments at Chicagoland did as far as showing Ray in a bad light and he's going to keep doing it.
Melissa - August 17, 2006 07:06 PM (GMT)
I wouldn't call Jeremy's actions subtle.
lalabee - August 17, 2006 07:10 PM (GMT)
More subtle then actually out right saying what it is he is implying. Both now and at Chicagoland. He alluded to the fact that Ray was never around and stuff.
I would have respected it more if he would have just called Ray out and stood behind what he said. If you have think you have the balls to say it, have the balls to back it up.
Melissa - August 17, 2006 07:15 PM (GMT)
This debate will continue for quite some time and the true facts will never come out. It is a major case of this side says one thing and the other side says another.
IF the rumors are correct then who does it really hurt, themselves, thats it. IF the rumors aren't correct then reputations have been tarnished because of someone else's meanness.
In this I agree with Ray, it is his personal life and nobody's business but his. If people would spend less time on his personal life then they would have more time to spend on their own business.
In the end who in the hell really cares. Put that cars on the track and lets race!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Melissa - August 17, 2006 07:18 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (lalabee @ Aug 17 2006, 03:04 PM) |
| QUOTE | | I have seen nothing in the contact between them that proves Jeremy's accusations. |
Well, the reason why is right here in your post:
| QUOTE | | Neither Ray nor Erin are stupid. I have no doubt that they are well aware of the effects of these rumors on her career. |
|
In my experience, a man Ray's age that is having a fling with a woman Erin's age is a hell of alot happier that Ray has looked this year. Hell you wouldn't be able to know the grin off his face.
NeverBeenThawed - August 17, 2006 07:54 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (kk9mm88 @ Aug 17 2006, 01:15 PM) |
IF the rumors are correct then who does it really hurt, themselves, thats it. IF the rumors aren't correct then reputations have been tarnished because of someone else's meanness.
|
Who does it hurt? Not just themselves. What about all the little girls out there who want to go into auto racing and view(ed?) her as a role model?
Carriek928 - August 17, 2006 08:38 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (kk9mm88 @ Aug 17 2006, 02:15 PM) |
This debate will continue for quite some time and the true facts will never come out. It is a major case of this side says one thing and the other side says another.
IF the rumors are correct then who does it really hurt, themselves, thats it. IF the rumors aren't correct then reputations have been tarnished because of someone else's meanness.
In this I agree with Ray, it is his personal life and nobody's business but his. If people would spend less time on his personal life then they would have more time to spend on their own business.
In the end who in the hell really cares. Put that cars on the track and lets race!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
:nod I honestly, don't care if he and Erin are together or not...you are right, its their personal lives, and it shouldn't matter. I know, Jeremy did eluded about him not being there for the team and to the fact that he was always with Erin...but IMO, he was just a disgruntled employee throwing dirt...with that said, and before you get upset at me, do I agree with Ray? No. Do I agree with Jeremy? No. I like Jeremy and always root for him but right now, I am not very happy with his actions. Fine, file the lawsuit, I don't have a problem with that, I think he got a raw deal anyways. But don't go making comments about personal stuff.
And so what, if they are together? Sorry, I don't see the big deal...they are both adults. I understand that maybe they are spending more time together and that looks suspicious that he is negligent of his other teams...but not really. Now if lets say he was with Erin on a weekend vacation instead of being at the track all the time, then that would be cause for concern, but for now, as far as anyone knows, they are just working together...she is still developing as a driver, whereas Jeremy is pretty much a pro compared to her so in theory, she needs him more than he does.
Just my thoughts and opinions. Thems not fighting words. :)
Mist - August 17, 2006 09:14 PM (GMT)
Jeremy putting it in the court papers made it legit for the "mainstream" media (who were probably waiting for a good way to bring it up). Column is up on Sports Illustrated.com. This guy is pretty neutral about it, but if SI will write about it, so will everybody else.
Column| QUOTE |
In court papers, Mayfield said, "For significant periods of time (Evernham) has been, at best, an absentee manager and owner, largely because ... at some point in time Ray Evernham had entered into a close personal relationship with a female driver he engages to drive. That relationship became the subject of considerable discussion and distraction in the Nextel Cup garage area during the 2006 season."
"Close personal relationship?" Let's put it this way: Evernham, who turns 49 later this month, and the 25-year-old Crocker are more than friends. It's not a subject anybody likes to talk or write about -- it's taboo in the Cup garage -- but when it impacts the performance of the car, it becomes a subject in the public arena. |
And they picked the absolute worst picture of Erin to go with an article like that.
ccjmfan - August 18, 2006 05:12 AM (GMT)
im on Jeremys side and thats ALL im saying
lalabee - August 18, 2006 01:22 PM (GMT)
It's too much to quote, but what MIST posted is EXACTLY what I have been trying to say. Jeremy is slinging mud and it's working. For everyone who is saying that them being together isn't a big deal, I bet there are a lot of guys in that Cup garage who would beg to differ.
Look at it this way. If one of your coworkers started having an intimate relationship with your boss, how would you feel? If it seemed that your coworker was getting special treatment because of it and your problems were overlooked, how would you feel?
I don't know what some of you do for a living, or even if the majority of people on this board are out of high school or even college, but dipping the pen in company ink is NOT a good thing. Not for the dipper OR the dippee! Anyone sho gets involved can kiss any respect from their coworkers goodbye. For a woman who is trying to make her way in a man's world, it's even worse.
So I'm just going to flat out say what I know a lot of people think and just won't say. Unless Erin starts to perform on the track, I refuse to believe that she's in that truck still for any other reason than her relationship with Ray. Being a woman got her in it and personal stuff id keeping her in it. Period.
Melissa - August 18, 2006 01:31 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (lalabee @ Aug 18 2006, 09:22 AM) |
Look at it this way. If one of your coworkers started having an intimate relationship with your boss, how would you feel? If it seemed that your coworker was getting special treatment because of it and your problems were overlooked, how would you feel?
|
Actually I have been the the position of a boss dating a co-worker. He did it every summer.
It was their personal life and it didn't effect me in the least.
lalabee - August 18, 2006 01:57 PM (GMT)
Then I don't know what field of work you're in because in my line of work, PR,- which is beyond cut throat- that WOULD NOT fly! No way. I
work my ass off to get my accounts and if one of my coworkers started dating one of the bosses and started getting more accounts or better accounts, the boss would need a whole army of body gaurds. Wait, let me correct myself. If the coworker wasn't even given the accounts, they could have an unfair advantage and even then, there would be mutiny.
NeverBeenThawed - August 18, 2006 02:05 PM (GMT)
In most lines of work, it's highly unprofessional to date/sleep with the boss. Even if it doesn't affect you personally, that doesn't mean that it's not going to create tension and hostility throughout the workplace.
Sleeping with the boss also creates a bit of a liability issue...at that point you're just one step away from a sexual harrassement lawsuit. What happens when there's trouble in paradise?
No matter what, when you start dating your boss, you can't escape the perception that your relationship is fueling your career.
I have no doubt that Jeremy knew what he was doing, and, to be quite honest, I'm glad he did it. Clearly it's caused problems in the EMS stables, and apparently, throughout the garage area as well. Erin is going to have a difficult time ever escaping from this fact. This all puts a bad name on the diversity they try to create in the sport.
If you still don't believe it, then, well, I'm sorry that you can't see it. I believe it because of what I've seen, as well as the fact that neither of them have come out and openly denied it, either. Sleeping with the boss is such bad pr, and if it weren't true they would have come out and denied like crazy. Erin still stands a chance at redemption, in my eyes, if she does the honorable thing and finds another (truck) ride.
AmeriKahneGirl924 - August 18, 2006 02:16 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (lalabee @ Aug 18 2006, 08:57 AM) |
Then I don't know what field of work you're in because in my line of work, PR,- which is beyond cut throat- that WOULD NOT fly! No way. I
work my ass off to get my accounts and if one of my coworkers started dating one of the bosses and started getting more accounts or better accounts, the boss would need a whole army of body gaurds. Wait, let me correct myself. If the coworker wasn't even given the accounts, they could have an unfair advantage and even then, there would be mutiny. |
Amen! The same would go for my job too. And I work with a bunch of counselors, so you know we would have all the self-intellectual material to blow the relationship out of the water!
I think this hurts not only EMS, but women and diversity in general. I think they BOTH should have realized they couldn't keep it secret forever and that it would VERY damaging to her career.
Lucky Ducky - August 18, 2006 02:25 PM (GMT)
There is absolutely nothing I can say that Lala, Erica, or Never haven't already said.
And honestly, I can't fault Jeremy for calling it like it is. I've been there. A couple of times, in fact. And whoever said that the boss dating employees hasn't effected them, well, I think that's BS.
It might not have been noticible, the dipping in the company ink is NEVER good for anyone.
smokeyslost - August 18, 2006 02:51 PM (GMT)
I have first hand experience of the effect from your supervisor shitting where he eats is no good. Basically, my intern was banging the Sr. VP of sales and when the time came; I received the walking papers and she got my gig.
Martz - August 19, 2006 12:14 PM (GMT)
Article
Mayfield: Evernham's love life sunk No. 19 teamBROOKLYN, Mich. -- Nextel Cup owner Ray Evernham declined on Friday to discuss court allegations that his relationship with developmental driver Erin Crocker led to the downfall of the No. 19 team and former driver Jeremy Mayfield.
Mayfield alleged in an Aug. 9 lawsuit filed in Iredale (N.C.) County to block his termination that Evernham was an absentee manager largely because of his "close personal relationship with a female driver he engages to drive on NASCAR's ARCA, Truck and Busch Series."
"That relationship became a subject of considerable discussion and distraction in the Nextel Cup garage area during the 2006 season," the court document said.
The document did not directly name Crocker, but she is the only female driver employed by Evernham Motorsports.
Evernham, who was in the garage with Crocker at Michigan International Speedway during qualifying for Sunday's race, issued the following statement through his public relations staff.
"The lawsuit is over and I'm not going to discuss the allegations," he said. "I am looking forward to putting together the best race team I can with Elliott Sadler and a great group of sponsors.
"I'm also looking forward to getting Kasey Kahne back in the top 10 and to keep Scott Riggs on the path to Victory Lane."
Sadler, who was given his immediate release from the No. 38 car of Robert Yates Racing earlier this week, moved forward by qualifying second in the No. 19 that Mayfield had driven since 2002.
He said Mayfield's allegations weren't a concern.
"I haven't read a lot of the stuff that's been going on," Sadler said. "I've been trying to stay away from it. To me, Ray has been amazing. He has been unbelievably patient, working with me, working with the guys, making sure we have all of our stuff ready for next year.
"We pretty much didn't talk about any kind of contract stuff, any kind of problems that's gone on in the past. Both of us want to put all that behind us and it's kind of a fresh start here at Michigan."
The terms of the settlement forbid both parties from talking about certain allegations in the lawsuit, which was decided in Mayfield's favor.
But both parties actively attacked the other in the lawsuit.
Mayfield and business manager Dale Cagle accused Evernham of being an absentee owner and providing inferior equipment.
"Unfortunately, as we all know, Ray has been distracted this year by outside events -- I don't need to elaborate -- and the leadership void that developed assured that the 19 team would never get what it needed to be competitive," Cagle said in a letter dated Aug. 8.
"For all intents and purposes, Ray has been an absentee owner/manager who has not been actively engaged in the affairs or operations of the 19 car. The fact is, and any fair person would have to admit, Jeremy has not had a competitive team, he has not had competitive cars to drive ... These too are clear breaches of the driving services contract."
Evernham accused Mayfield of missing meetings to make the car better, for purposely wrecking and performing poorly. He also said Mayfield did not give his best effort to promote the team and its sponsors.
Evernham referred to the July 23 race at Pocono where Mayfield pitted on Lap 175 of a 200-lap race for a flat tire that wasn't flat.
He also referred to an Aug. 7 crash at Indianapolis Motor Speedway that led to Mayfield falling out of the top 35 in owners' points that guarantee a spot in the field each week.
"I watched Mayfield wreck his car early in the race," Evernham said in his deposition. "He slowed dramatically to let other cars pass the 19 in Turn 1 and then brushed the wall at two places.
"This wreck was done in a manner to wreck the 19 but not to harm Mayfield. Based on my experience, I believe Mayfield's conduct in wrecking the car was on purpose. Sam Johns, my competition director, agreed with my opinion."
Evernham said there was no factual support to suggest he gave Mayfield inferior equipment. He said Mayfield "disparaged the Evernham team and me personally," and brought forth several witnesses for support.
Chuck Efaw, a mechanic for the 19, testified that Mayfield did not give his best effort.
"At the race in Loudon, N.H., last month, Shana Mayfield, Jeremy's wife, said to me, 'I told Jeremy he better not have that car in the top 35 at the end of the season.'"
"I took this to mean that Jeremy knows he will be driving for a competing race team next season, so it would be to his advantage to put the 19 at a competitive disadvantage going into next season," Efaw testified.
Kirk Almquist, the car director for the 19, testified that "Jeremy's actions have been extremely damaging to the team and our sponsors."
Almquist referred to a conversation with Mayfield at New Hampshire in which Mayfield told him, "Don't trust Ray. Ray is [expletive] with me."
He said Mayfield added, "If Ray wants to get rid of me, maybe I will stay and make Ray pay me for the rest of my contract."
According to the court documents, Evernham and Cagle met in June to discuss the relationship between Evernham and Mayfield.
During that meeting, the documents said Evernham planned to sign Sadler but assured Mayfield it was to drive a fourth team and not the No. 19. That was consistent with what Evernham said earlier this week in a conference call announcing Sadler as his new driver.
When it was reported that Sadler had been recruited to drive the 19, Mayfield was called by a representative of EMS to say the story was wrong.
It also was during that June meeting, according to the documents, that Evernham invited Mayfield to "explore options for 2007."
On July 31, Cagle informed Evernham to inform him that Mayfield was close to signing with another team, which NASCAR.COM reported was Bill Davis Racing, and that Mayfield would need his release from 2007.
The following week, Mayfield crashed at Indianapolis. Cagle was informed a day later that Bill Elliott would drive the 19 the next week at Watkins Glen International.
A few days later, Evernham told reporters at Watkins Glen that Mayfield was terminated.
By then, Mayfield had sought a court injunction to keep Elliott out of the car at Watkins Glen. He said earlier in the week that merely was to posture himself to be paid for the rest of the season, something Evernham initially did not want to do.
After the court ruled in Mayfield's favor, Evernham representatives contacted Cagle to inform him that Mayfield would be compensated for the remainder of 2006.
An announcement on Mayfield's new deal with Bill Davis Racing is expected within the next week, leaving both parties to move forward.
Kahne, who is 11th in points with four races left before the 10-race Chase to the Nextel Cup field is set, for one is glad.
"It's good that it's over with," he said. "We know what we have and we just don't have to worry about it anymore. We will start working with Elliott and just make our teams better and everybody at Evernham Motorsports better and don't have to worry about everything else that's going on."
Scrapbookgirl9 - August 19, 2006 12:20 PM (GMT)
okay here is my theory on it.........
let's stop the mud-slinging and just move on.
If Ray and Erin are together.......then fine, to me at this point I think it would be best if they are to jus come out and say it and be done with it
I'm not even going to get into if its right or if its wrong, cause that isn't for me to decide.
LittleManFan - August 19, 2006 04:39 PM (GMT)
I agree with you, Christy. Let's get our focus back on racin'.
Lauren - August 19, 2006 04:46 PM (GMT)
ok i've been tryin to steer clear of this but... wtf!? lol ok isn't Ray married?
LittleManFan - August 19, 2006 04:49 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (Lauren @ Aug 19 2006, 11:46 AM) |
| ok i've been tryin to steer clear of this but... wtf!? lol ok isn't Ray married? |
I believe he's divorced...