Honestly, JER may think that folks will hop on the Whitney bandwagon again once Valerie starts slapping her around and calling her incest whore.

But truthfully, I won't feel sorry for her.

What JER has done to Whitney is beyond disgusting. Even when the pervert is proven NOT to be her brother, the memories of their copulation will be too strong to get past.

*** Especially if he's still up her a$$, which we know he will be. HE HAS NO STORY.

In two months time when Val is nipping at Whitney's heels the way Liz was nipping at Eve's heels, will anyone care? I know I won't. I'll be cheering on Val.

Has JER stuck Whitney in a whole so deep that she'll never get out of? As long as the pervert resides in Harmony, YES.

How will fans get past the fact that she slept with the pervert, believing he's her brother? As much as I loathe the Teresa character, I don't think she should bother giving Whitney the time or day after hearing about her sleeping with the pervert.

JER has effectively KILLED Whitney!! How?

Because as long as she choses to be around the pervert, I don't SEE her. I see a NEW CREATION. An IMMORAL version of old Whitney.. a shadow with no pride or self-respect.. a deviant who lucks out when the pervert turns out not to be her brother.

Thus, as long as she's with the pervert, she CANNOT be redeemed.. she CANNOT be supported.. she CANNOT be stomached. Even when the truth comes out, if she's with the pervert, I'll just shake my head in dismay and say "Nothing happened to those disgusting fools for what they did! They got away with saying FU to God and the rest of the world and have no shame about it."

Bottom line: pervert and Whitney aren't a lovestory. So as long as JER keeps her with him, she won't be redeemed and I'll have to continue boycotting the show.

Glorified perversion and tokenism are big NO NOs with me.
In essence, JER has made Whitney unfit for consumption.. and has gifted every viewer who has silently said that that "black Russell bitch needs to be back with her idiot pervert so that the good men of Harmony are safe from her."

Is our dear Whitney ruined for good? (I believe so, because JER REFUSES to write for the pervert separate from Whitney.. and each second he spends around her will forever be a dirty reminder of her dirty and wicked behavior.)

Can she be saved? (Only if she kills the pervert. And since I don't see that happening, I say no again.)

RUN BROOK RUN from this travesty and DISGRACEFUL "story"!!!!

E.

:good:

I agree but I've come to a conclusion that she can be redeemed but not with Chad around. So Chad is going to have to die or dissapear for a very long time. He's a horrible influence on her pysche. :nono:

*sigh*

Have you seen abused women around their abusers? That's Whitney around dud. And apparently she'll NEVER be free of him. And until Whitney can be the Whitney I know she can be even around dumbass then she won't be redeemed for me. Any progress she makes HAS to hold true regardless of her being around dud.

Val snipping at Whit ain't nothing new. They just swapped Simone with Val. At least Simone has her own shit now.

Het dear you call Simone being a lesbian a story? Granted it wouldn't have been my first choice for Simone or for Cathy to show the level of talent we all know she has BUT at least if JER had skills this could have been written correctly but I know it won't be.

I agree with most of what you said E, but Teresa won't bail on Whitney and she's just as bad IF not worse so too peas in a pod......

"FATE" is not Whitney's thing that's Teresa's as Sylv just pointed out so I don't get why JER's tryin' to shove that ish down our throats.

idk...i just don't know...

i'm still pretty dazed from enduring this week's eppys.

Frankly, Crys as bad as Simone's lez story MAY be it's still better than her involved in the disaster that's incest. At least she's free.

I absolutely think she can be redeemed. Especially since ALL her secrets will be out within the next two weeks or so. I think once she's away from incest, it's not that hard. That and I think JER has something up his sleeve for Whitney. I really am trusting Brook on this one. So I'm hanging on for now.

Well to me she's not ruining since i didn't see her do Nasty Ass.

Val is going to way worse because she will know that she is an obstacle for Dudney while Simone never did because Simone never knew that Dudney were macking on each other behind her back. Even after Simone knew, she never did try to break them up like Beth did with Shuis and Kay did with Charguel and Ivy did with Gram. That is why I don't buy Val being like Liz.. Teve were never really a true love couple since their relatiionship was never written for or developed like the other true love couples on the show such as Charguel, Gram, and Shuis. Hell, JER didn't both to write crap for them like he does with Dudney.. Not to mention, Whitney's secret will be out. Val doesn't have anything to hang over her head like Liz did with Eve which is pretty much allowed Liz to have full access to TC Eve had a way to put an end to Tiz.. All she had to do was tell TC the truth but she didn't.

I think Val is going to be a Kay, Theresa, Ivy, Beth, and Liz combo.

Good points. But it will all still be dumb because both women are gonna have to be dumbed down to his level.

LOL Mo I I'm with you on this one. She isn't ruined for me cause I didnt see this mess. Neither his Fox since I didnt see Kox either.

Whitney is Easily redeemed just write her as she is someone who has LOW SELF ESTEEM.

Her self-esteem is the toilet that's they key. Just have her say to the fool. I deserve better than you. You are a despicable lowdown cretin. The signs were there for a long time but I ignored them. Just empower her and let her break free from the chains of a dysfunctional sick perverted relationship. But what ever happens she MUST stand up to that SICK PERVERTED DISGUSTING NASTY person that she laid down with. She has to take off the blinders and finally see him for who he is. But dont just let it be about Dud show that she thinks she is worthless and that God hates her thats why he is punishing her. Just like women who spent years being abused breakfree Whitney needs to breakfree. She needs to reclaim her life and self respect. Thats how you redeem her.

Carol

As long as Whitney is in Dud's sphere..

YES, she is ruined.

Period.

The only way to possibly begin to redeem Whitney is to make her lose her mind. She has to go stark, raving crazy. Only after she has gone through a mental breakdown,

AND RID HERSELF OF DUD..

Can she begin to come out of it.

But, to be honest, she'll always have this stain on her character. Always.

But, if she went crazy, and the audience could apply it to her being insane and mentally unbalanced...

They would be open to Whitney having a decent relationship with someone else.

NOT DUD.

As for Val...

The problem is....I'll be rooting FOR Val. And, I'm going to support Val wherever I can. Write positively about her. WHo gives a crap what she does. I said before - she could be a serial killer, and I'll STILL SUPPORT HER.

Because CRAPNEY IS UNROOTABLE. CRAPNEY IS GARBAGE. CRAPNEY IS NOTHING TO GIVE SUPPORT TO IN THE LEAST.

So, GO VAL.

No, she's not. Not if they send her off to a convent for 5 episodes, I think that gives you a hint of that Whitney is gradually going to realize the truth of their relationship, I mean everything not just the incest part. I agree, she needs to have a break down, although I think she should she see a pyschologist, not join a convent! After that,
I hope they focus on the triangle between her and Valerie and she decides to end her relationship with pyscho-freak. : :angry:

No she isn't. She just needs to get help.

welcome foxneyrules! i hope realizes soon too.

There is NO WAY Val can come anywhere near Beth, Teresa, or Kay in those stories because in each of those stories TWO families were being ripped apart because of the couple. With pervertney, one ONE family is affected, the Russells.

That's why I continue to ask is Foxney the norm, or pervertney the exception.

Pervertney is ONLY similar, in a way, to ONE couple, and that is TEVE.

Why do I say that?

Because JER did NOT have Whitney start having feelings for pervert PRE-pregnancy, but AFTERWARDS.

1) Whitney repeatedly had fantasies about pervertney WITH child, never without.
2) Eve repeatedly had fantasies about her family WITH Simone and Whitney, never without.

You see, with the other couples, the feelings were NEVER in question.
With Shuis, Charguel, ET/Gwen, Gram, the feelings were ALWAYS there.. never contigent upon a child.

So, if JER wanted to sell pervertney as a lovestory, all he had to do was write it as so BEFORE she found out she was pregnant, which he didn't. Moreover, he could have corrected his mistake by allowing the audience to see them going through the torture of not being together, NOT torturing the audience of showing them together. LOL

Like I said, to me, JER is clearly replacing TEVE with pervertney because ALL of Whitney's feelings for pervert is tied to the kid. If the baby wasn't with pervert, would Whitney have found her way to pervert during the disaster? I HIGHLY doubt it. It's always about the baby.

The only difference between TEVE and pervertney is that TC is a little more rounded in that we SEE how he's a great friend to Sam.. we SEE him as a caring father. As for pervert, the only thing we know is that he's a pervert and willing to BUY and USE a kid to get Whitney in the sack.

If pervertney is really supposed to be different from TEVE, yet so like those other couples, why didn't JER do some lovely scenes of them lying in a beautiful bed, back-to-back, while they talked about their past? Why didn't he show them dying from the TORTURE of denying themselves the way he did when Fox was in love with Whitney.. the way he's done with Charguel.. the way he's done with the other couples mentioned?

Folks, I don't want to be dense here, JER is no fool and knows how to write a lovestory when he wants. Certain scenes tend to appear, and not a SINGLE IOTA of one has surfaced for pervertney.

Moreover, I must go back to the fact that JER REFUSES to write for pervert. And you can't say it's because divins can't act worth sh*t because look at Danica.

So what gives? Is it because pervertney is black and JER doesn't think they're worth a real love story, or is this sh*t it?

If it's this, then JER just gave pervertney fans the biggest slap in the face.

Val is simply Liz in all this because like with TEVE, Whitney will continue to fight for a relationship that's clearly not for her.

Out of ALL of the other relationships, when have you ever known the women to react the way Whitney did when she saw Val with pervert? NEVER. Whitney barely batted an eyelash. She simply DECIDED that she still loved pervert and wanted him back. She didn't even get mad at him. It was surreal.

Whenever Eve caught Liz all over TC, she simply blamed Liz, but NEVER TC, which I too thought was surreal. I always complained (and still do) that Eve is weak and refuse to assert her voice around TC. Ironically, I see the same with pervertney.

This has Teve/Liz written all over it. Whitney is part of a major family, and pervert is a mut that doesn't really interact with any family but the Russells. Is that weird, or racist?

If I am to believe that pervertney is like the other couples, then JER has just given them the finger by having them have sex. True love couples suffer from not being with each other. Hell, last I remember, Charguel STILL hadn't had sex. And when pervertney first had sex, it happened because of a disaster dealing with Teresa. How is that love? It's always a damn disaster. LOL JER knows how to write a lovestory, I repeat. We have seen it.

If JER wanted to write for pervertney and Val, and have it NOT be like TEVE, and have it mean MORE, then pervert would have REACTED to the truth of Whitney lying about the kid. Pervert would have gotten MAD at Whitney the way Sheridan, Ethan, and Sam have gotten mad at their loves. Not so with pervert. He's okay with all the lies. And THAT is NOT a love story.

JER could have easily had pervert stay with Val after finding out about how Whitney lied, yet still LONG for her. But not so. Instead, we've got Whitney playing house with pervert while Val is doing Lord knows what. Whitney will be arguing with Val the EXACT same way Eve did with Liz. Why? Because in JER's mind, black women can't get along.

If JER wanted to sell pervertney as a lovestory, there are sooooo many things he could have done better. All we have to do is look at the other couples to know that. With every other couple, each individual is made BETTER in some way. Not so with pervertney. With every other couple, JER SHOWS/TELLS how each is made better. Not so with pervertney.

Like with TEVE, this whole situation is going to be more about Whitney than anything else. What I think is funny is that Whitney continues to treat pervert like garbage in all this, yet he doesn't flinch since he's so consumed with the thought of screwing his sister. Hopefully Val will speak for pervert and point that out to Whitney, the way Liz did with Eve.

If JER is painting a lovestory, he doesn't have the man/woman return to the relationship because of the child:

Shuis were back together way before Sheridan FIGURED OUT the baby was hers. Ethan forgave and renewed his affections for Teresa DESPITE believing that Little Ethan is Julian's.
Charity still loves Miguel DESPITE knowing that Maria is Kay's with Miguel.

Why the discrepency with pervertney? Tell me why.

We can't have it both ways.

Either JER is writing pervertney this way and making them a mockery of the WHITE couples because they are BLACK, or in the end, it will be Foxney.

RUN BROOK RUN!!!

E.

I agree with you Sorcera. I don't like the storyline either. I personally think that the storyline is leading back to Foxney in a very sick, twisted way. Foxay or Kox are in my opinion, a storyline that shows us a new side of Fox's character with Kay. He was a playboy before he met Whitney but she turned him around and Fox brought Whitney to life. They both had secrets, Fox loves her, but didn't tell her and then denied it when Whitney overheard him talking to Ethan. Whitney's secret was that Miles is Chad's baby, not Fox's, whether or not she is related to Chad. I think that JER is trying to show why Whitney and Fox should be together. They are weakened now that they are apart. They need each other to truly be happy. To do this JER is relying on stereotypes of three things.
1) Black couples and how they interact
2) Black Women
3) Black men vs White Men in relationships(Evian vs Teve), (Foxney vs Dudney) and as fathers, because both TC and Chad are made to look like fools even though TC is a better father then Julian is to Fox. Chad is not a good father, but you know that Fox would be.

I maybe a naive fool but I belive it's the latter. I agree with everything in your post esp about Whit's suposed feelings for dud are only tied to her baby.

I completely agree with E and FR. Great points family. I would think it was a sign that all roads, no matter how twisted, lead back to Foxney.

As far as Black Couples and how they interact, JER just doesn't know how to write it. The writer of Hidden Passions wrote TC/Eve far better than JER ever has.

I dunno what his deal is with Black women, and don't care to know.

As far as Black Men vs. White Men in relationships, TC is far better than Dud EVER has been. TC has a true and genuine friendship with Sam that doesn't depend upon what TC thinks Sam could do for him. Dud's ' friendship' with Fox was a crock. Do I need to bring up what Dud did in L.A.? And, TC is a far better father than my man Julian. I love Julian, but he's a LOUSY parent. TC is consistent with his children, and his parenting may be ' Old School', but that doesn't make it bad parenting. Just makes it ' Old School'. I wrote awhile ago that TC was kept out of the loop where Whitney, her pregnancy and the truth about it were concerned, because a lot of the garbage Whitney was going through simply wouldn't be happening IF TC had known the truth. He loves his children, and it's so obvious, because he has fought for his children when he's thought they were wronged in a way that Julian never has. The one huge unanswered question with regards to TC is where the hell his 'perfection' complex came from. That's the most maddening thing about him, because it's shaped so much of how he's related to Eve and why her 'fall from grace' was so devastating.

Dud, on the other hand, bought a baby so that he could do his freaky incest plans with Whitney. We don't know what kind of father Fox will be, but all we can point to is his reaction from when he first found out about Whitney's pregnancy.

HE DID NOT RUN.
He didn't even THINK about running.
There were no excuses.
No, ' I'm not ready to be a Daddy' from him.

He stepped up to the plate, like a man, and never looked back where ' his' son was concerned. Fox didn't let anyone bully him into remotely thinking that he wasn't going to be there for his child. Julian buckled like a cheap suit to Alistair all those years ago. Fox didn't. He stood his ground like a man.

I agree with you completely rikyrah.