These kids...

What am I going to do with them???

Pete and I are home having lunch (30 minutes after my "confessional" post about what a flop my planted tank is) and I'm looking at it and see this tiny swarm of something in the water with two Bolivian Rams in the center of the "swarm". Meanwhile, the angelfish, other rams, and caucatoides are all herded to the far corner of the tank, looking rather stressed.



I never anticipated breeding in this tank.

What do I do now?

How do I feed them?

Will the parents continue to take care of them, or are they eventually going to kill my other fish?

As usual, HELP!!!

Oh my gosh, how exciting!! When you least expect it look what happens.

It looks like there are hundreds of them. :blink:

I can't help you - I'm still waiting to see if ours will ever spawn, but good luck with them.

Aura, I'm waiting on Klaus to bail me out on this one...I am clueless, once again...

I'm seriously wondering if all the dead plant matter has contributed to this little incident??? Life has been kind of crazy lately and the tanks aren't quite as clean as they normally are...

And then they spawn???

I mean, it's not that I didn't expect spawning, but with a pleco and all the other fish in the tank, I didn't expect anything to make it past egg status.

Do they like dead plants? (If so, this might be something you and I are good at, Aura!) I have read of people putting dead leaves in their SA tanks, so I'm wondering if this could be the case.

And these guys aren't big at all, probably less than 2 inches.

I'll try to get some clearer pics tonight. I just wish I had moved them into a tank of their own before this happened.

Now I feel like a bad fish mommy. worry wart!

Kim

yikes Oh man, here we go again Giggly Giggly Giggly

Kim, first of all: CALM DOWN, GET A DRINK AND ENJOY THEM Cheers!!!

OK, now that you enjoyed them, you have to make the decision if you want to keep some of them or not. If you want to keep some, you have to siphon the babies out into a small tank and feed them with freshly hatched BBS.

If you don't want to keep some, sit back, get another drink and keep enjoying them as long as they last. Eventually the little buggers will start to go on little discovery trips and the parents just can't be everywhere. So mother nature will take it's course and the Cacatuoides and Angels will have a good meal.

CONGRATULATION MOM Gimme an A! Gimme an A! Gimme an A! Gimme an A!

It almost sounds easier to catch all the fish cowering in the corner!

Okay, I'll siphon babies when I get home from work! I'll move them to the little 5G with the plants that are thriving because I never touch them.

I put brine shrimp in the hatchery at lunch time, it just seemed like a good idea! Is that all they will eat?

This is exciting...

Now, next question...

Do I move the parents with them???

If not, should I move the parents to another smaller tank so they can raise their own next time?

I'm really very calm... blinky

Do they like dirty tanks with dead plants in them?

We really have to find something that I know about but you don't so that I can repay you for all your help... Good Job

Hey, Kenny Wayne has a new cd that I'm picking up tonight...I'll burn that for you!

Kim

Okay, most of them have been moved to the 5G planted tank. There are probably close to 50 of them still in the main tank with the parents...No way to get them all. There is a sponge over the intake tube, and lots of caves and crevices for them to escape the filter flow if they need to. They are all over the place. Not much bigger than the brine shrimp I'll be feeding them later!

How many eggs do these guys have anyway? Klaus, I bet there are 200 babies total!

Are they hard to raise???

Kim

When you're good, you're good! Cheers!!!

Is that all they will eat? yes

Do I move the parents with them??? yikes Absolutely not

If not, should I move the parents to another smaller tank so they can raise their own next time? If you like to see them bring up their babies, that would be a good idea.

I'm really very calm... yeah yeah Giggly Giggly

Do they like dirty tanks with dead plants in them? These tanks are not dirty, they are naturel. Yes, they like some plant debries

We really have to find something that I know about but you don't so that I can repay you for all your help... Hey, you are the mbuna mama Good Job

Hey, Kenny Wayne has a new cd that I'm picking up tonight...I'll burn that for you!
Bouncy Bouncy Bouncy Thank you

Congrats, Kim!

Hey Klaus, could you feed them some very
finely chopped flake food?

Just wondering. Hmmmm

I can't believe how small they are in comparison to the mbuna fry I'm used to seeing. Faint

Maybe I should start looking at mine with a magnifying glass. I have plenty of plant debris, so who knows what I might find. Wiggle it just a little bit!

Klaus, you are always so calm. What does it take to get you excited - fish related?

Aura, I am so glad you clarified your question! On the Floor Laughing On the Floor Laughing

Hey Klaus, Kim is just another Kentuckian who is
freaking out about her hobby! Giggly

We are truly laid back people, but we tend to get more
than a little upset about our passions and hobbies! fishy

Well, so far, so good.

Babies in the 5G tank are doing fine, all over the place. I hope those stupid snails don't eat them.

The parents still have alot of babies in with them, there was no way to get them all and we thought it might be best to let them do their parent thing a bit. They are amazing as far as defending the fry goes...They don't hesitate to chase off angelfish 3 times their size. The little rummy nose tetras are allowed to swim above them, but nothing else is.

When Pete was siphoning out the fry, both parents were attacking the siphon over and over, violently.

I am going to move this pair into a 10G by themselves once all the fry are gone so I can experience the full effect of them caring for the fry...

Pretty neat to get to see parents defend their babies and hover over them like this!

Kim

When I raised Kribs and convicts, I always enjoyed
watching them parent their brood.

When one little fry got a little too far from home, one of
the parents would swoop in and suck the fry into their mouth
and then the parent would go back and spit the fry back into
the fold!

They are certainly violent in their protection as well. My Jack Russell
used to put his nose against the glass of the tank and the parents would
attack the glass!

I miss my egg layers, but I can't leave my Mbuna's just yet!
I'm planning on getting a 125 gallon tank in a few months, probably
for Christmas, and I'm torn between africans, sa. or mixed planted
community tank!

Oh well, plenty of time to decide that. I think it might depend on Kim
and Pete and when they decide to move to Kentucky! I will have access to
some amazing fish then!

Hey Klaus, could you feed them some very finely chopped flake food?

I don't think it would work for them. Maybe in a month or two but right now they go after the movement. The little BBS are moving around the tank and that attracts them.


Klaus, you are always so calm. What does it take to get you excited - fish related?

Aura, I am not telling you Nanananaa Nanananaa Nanananaa


Kim, I am glad you guys enjoy watching the parenting. To me THAT is why I love cichlids. Cloud 9 Cloud 9

It is certainly amazing to watch them with their fry, Klaus. I'm getting a taste of why you are so drawn to the fish that you keep!

The male cacatuoide has gotten a taste of it, as well. He almost got his face ripped off yesterday - I guess he got too close. I'm going to remove some of the other fish this weekend, and try to let these two raise the fry. I can't take that away from them now that I see how hard they are working at it. It is really something.

Last night, right before our normal "lights out time", the pair started herding the babies into a corner. It was amazing to watch them. They would get them in their mouths and spit them into the group. This morning when I turned the lights on, one of the parents (I can't tell them apart) went over to a piece of driftwood that forms a bit of a cave and looked in, pretty much telling them that it was okay to come out, and within seconds, the fry were out and the parents were on guard.

The ones in the 5G are doing well. I covered the light in the center of the tank, making darker areas. We also unhooked the strong filter in the tank because the current was keeping the babies on the substrate too much, so now they're moving around all over the place. We're using one of those little cartridges that has suction cups and runs on an aerator for now, until they get larger. They seem to be doing well. We're doing daily water changes and feeding bbs.

Pretty neat experience, all the way around! Good Job

I would recommend it to anyone who has never had this type of parental care! It's a whole new world!

Kim

Here is a little clip of my Altispinosus looking after the fry:

Microgeophagus Altispinosus

Really great video!

They are such good little parents...

You haven't raised any of them yet, have you?

I'm just wondering how long they can keep this up, being on guard around the clock like that???

Or do they eventually just lose control and give up?

I can tell that every day the fry are getting a little more adventurous. The parents will watch them from more of a distance now, but if anything looks like it's even considering moving towards them, they are there, and fast. Today, rather than seeming to "herd" the fry, the parents seem to be just giving them a bit of freedom and following them around. They are taking over an entire half of a 40G tank, if you can believe that, in all their "tiny-ness"!

Kim

Cool video Klaus!

This is the part of the hobby that I'm missing right now!

I don't have enough tanks or space to raise the fry right now.
But soon, I plan on it!

Good luck Kim and what are you going to do with all those fry
now that you're planning on moving soon?

Wow...I missed this thread then read it and you sound like you're enjoying it...how cool! I have cavebrooding marguensis with fry and it's interesting, but with nobody else in the tank they really don't have to worry! It's really neat to see Klaus' video too!

Why, I thought Klaus could be their godfather or something like that! He needs more fish!

Kim

Yes Kim, I have. They are about 1" now. Here are some bad pictures but it will give you an idea of the size.

Starting to look like little fish rather than pieces of debris floating in the water! Thanks for the pics! Good Job

Someone told me the other day that I could tell if I was feeding them enough if their little bellies were orange at the end of the day! I laughed myself to death over that one! I must be getting old, because I think I'm a long way from distinguishing bellies on these little mites!

Larry got quite a kick out of the fact that I'm trying to get rid of fish and trying to save all these little ones! idunno

I just have a soft spot for babies, I guess...

I have another question...I've noticed alot of people are keeping German rams in with Bolivian rams...Wouldn't that be asking for trouble?

Kim

Personally I wouldn't do it.

Me, either...

But have you ever kept the German rams? Are they as hard to keep as they say?

They sure are cute...

(Wait til you hear this new KWS cd!!! It's fantastic!)

Kim